I found of picture ofHhoudini when he was with a trainer. Again, being much more of a saddleseat person, my tendency to trainer is more on the saddleseat style. However, with Hhoudini, I haven't done much of anything, my daughter just rides him and show him. At the last show, he did well but she had to constantly get into his mouth, it wasn't pretty. I like the way he moves, he's got alot of extenstion and impulsion and I don't want to lose that but his head is lower than this picture and he tends to stick his nose out. What do I need to do to get the show horse look back? All the other horses looks like their heads were glued into place whereas Hhoudini was all over the place. However, the glued in place horses were kind of trappy in their movement which I didn't like and the judge did tie Hhoudini over some of them because of it. Please any advise, I am eager to learn. Shoot, I can't get the picture to load. I will try again.

I am looking forward to seeing the response to this thread as well because after riding saddleseat for years, I got my first PB hunter a couple years ago and I'm showing my other one hunter this year as well

What type of bit are you using on him?

Without seeing a picture, it is hard to give advice.

Is he well conditioned? It takes an incredible motor to keep impulsion and a solid head set.

Does he flex laterally? Is his nose just sticking out or is he pulling also?

I know, I wish I could get this picture to load but I am having no luck. The horse is in fabulous condition. He is alittle on the chubby side but is well muscled up. His rump resembles more of quarter horse type with strong gaskins. We ride him on a Myler kimberwicke but sometimes ride him in a Myler full cheek snaffle. He seems to do better with a curb chain but I am just a big full cheek snaffle fan. Yes, he pulls. His lateral flexion is better. I've been bending quite alot when we go around the corners. In saddleseat, the corners are your friend, that's where we bend and kind of check the horse back for better impulsion on the straight aways. I've been doing that with Hhoudini and it seems to be helping. This horse is very well trained but also very smart, if he can cheat and get lazy, then he's going to do it. I just don't know what right buttons to push yet. I've been side passing him as well when he gets too heavy in the bridle. His teeth are good, his condition is good, his training is solid, I am just not real sure what to do.

If you do not think that conditioning is a problem, (and I am assuming he does not have a tooth issue), then I think I would do several things.

First, check your daughters hands. Is she heavy or light? She may be pulling on the bit causing him to move his head.

If you think he is just testing and getting away with it, then I would do a LOT of flexing and ground driving. Start with him just standing under saddle and take the rein and pull it to your hip and then loosen the rein. When he goes to move his head, pull it again. You should be able to get him to keep his head turned for several seconds before he moves it. Once he can do that, ground drive him and ask for him to move his head off center. He should be able to move his head from left to right without fighting.

You also might want to try a different bit. I can PM you if you want a suggestion.

When he pulls and you are riding him, you can do one of two things. The first would be to throw the reins away so he does not have anyhting to pull against. I never really like to do that though. The other would be to give him a LOT of leg and force him to drive himself underneath while cueing him to flex his head.

I have a mare who likes to get heavy in the bridle and it is a tough habit to break. We had to do a lot of lateral flexion with her and she will still get heavy when I ride. When she does that, I pull her head to the side, which makes her give in her neck and then give her back her mouth after she breaks off. She is to the point now where I only have to break her off slightly and she will frame up again.

Good luck with him...sounds like a good horse!

Very good advice, the horse needs to lift his shoulders and carry his front end while driving off of his hind end. That will really help him become more steady. It is kind of the same concept as and english horse, only not to that extreme.

Thanks, I started working him with the lateral flexion and it is already making a difference. He is easy to push on with my legs so getting him to round his back and work underneath himself isn't too hard. He is starting to get lighter. I am so used to my horses that back off the bit and are extremely light, so contact with the bit is a whole new concept. He will never be as typey as some of the half arabs we show against. He just doesn't have the conformation but he can cover some ground with his trot without even extending much. I've got a link to the last show which was the first time my daughter cantered him. She did well in one class but she got tired in the other and you can really see it in the picture. She just let him totally hollow out.

http://www.housmanphoto.com/WebGalleries/Individuals/Beth/

I see what you are talking about. I am assuming the picture second from the last one in the link is the horse that we have been discussing?

She has very little contact with his mouth-this is going to cause him to be able to move his head and hollow out his back. I would continue working on lateral flexion and working with the rider on her contact and hand position. One thing that might help her is to take an old apir of reins and wrap some tape around it and let her know that she needs to maintain the reins at that point. They also have colored reins that would help her visualize it. Sometimes, especially with a horse that leans into the bit, we feel like we are pulling on the reins but in actuality, they are very loose.

He looks like a nice horse. They make a pretty picture!

Here are some more links from our last show. My daughter showed him in a uxeter kimberwhich and as you can see, he is much more respectful but, generally speaking, not as happy in the bit. He doesn't chew on it as much nor does he generally wear his ears as much. However, I can take the martingale off and he doesn't move his head all around.
http://danitar.smugmug.com/gallery/4553575...47_nnFM4/Medium

http://danitar.smugmug.com/gallery/4553575...00_szbcU/Medium

http://danitar.smugmug.com/gallery/4553575...71_nkrKv/Medium

I've been lining lately and he seems to be much lighter.

hehehe................he is cheating & doing what is easiest for him. even in the kimberwicke he has little impulsion from behind. remember that he was also a WP horse and really does better in a curb in either discipline also. put on a pair of spurs, or use a crop along with the flexing for conditioning. when going around corners, you really have to tip his nose & neck to the inside and push his body with your inside leg. cantering circles also works well with him. if you need to, give Mark a call for advice

becky

ps
Twiggy was Top Five in HA Pl Driving & HA Park Open at region 12 this weekend
We will be at region 14 over 4th of July